Time As A Myth?

How wrong would I be in saying that there is no physical existence of time, only motion and the perception of it? Almost all of physics includes time as a physical entity, the "fourth dimension" if you will. Unfortunately, I am unable to see the existence of time as little more then mysticism. Here are my reasons for saying so.

First of all, I'd like to suggest that our only perception of time is through memories. I can think back to a moment in my "past", perhaps a scene with another person who also holds a memory of the situation. I can remember it so well that it almost feels concrete. Does that give it substance? I don't think so.

Rather then having gone forward in time from that memory, it seems more logical to say that the earth has moved around the sun, I have moved from one space to another... everything in the universe has moved through space, but not necessarily through time. My perception of the universe's motion only allows the conception (illusion) of time.

The second reason why I cannot accept time is that it appears to require that things are predetermined. Unless I am mistaken (which is entirely possible) the effects of general relativity (such as the twin paradox) seem to need the physical existence of a "timeline". If I am, for example, the twin who undergoes near light speed travel, time would "physically", not perceivably, but physically slow down for me. Yet I would perceive the physically slowed time as normal. Everyone knows how this story ends. I return hardly aged, hardly changed (save a haircut), yet my twin brother is an old, toothless, grandfather or whatever...

The point is that in this scheme of things, there is the physical existence of a timeline. The light-speed-traveling-brother was picked up at one point in time, and dumped at another. He physically time traveled to the future from his point of view, and who's to say that his time is dilated, when it's a mere matter of perspective. Along this line of thinking comes the conception of "fate", an idea i am not comfortable excepting as a physical existence. Hence, time seems but a myth to me.

Perhaps, I am wrong to suggest that the theory of General Relativity holds such an implication. Or maybe GR is suggesting the physical existence of time just as I've presented it. I may also be making faulty assumptions. Let me know what you think. I'm not trying to be philosophical--I'm actually trying to do the opposite. I am very interested in physics, but sadly uniformed. Please be understanding of this.

Btw, what made me think of this was watching this stupid interview with Dr. Michio Kaku. Does that guy really know what he's talking about? He seems to think that, in the future, time travel could be possible, because we could twist time into a pretzel or something like that. It seemed rather far-fetched to me for him to think of a timeline as a physical existence to be manipulated, and this is where that train of thought led me. Let me know what you think.

Everyone knows how this story will end.

Prof. Stephen Hawking has proposed a Chronology Protection Conjecture that "prevents the appearance of closed timelike curves". That is to say, time travel into the past would not be possible. Of course we all travel into the future, slowly. You can travel into the future much faster, really almost as fast as you want, by traveling at a very high velocity as in the twin paradox. We just can't travel into the past. That would produce the closed loop of time that Prof. Hawking believes is not allowed under our physics.

Some people think of time as just another way of expressing entropy, or the winding down of the universe. If that's the case, then it's clear that the entropy of the universe always increases, so time always moves forward.

In my opinion, Dr. Kaku's show is for entertainment purposes only. Perhaps it interests some people in science, and that's a good thing, but remember it has the word "fiction" in the title.

Peace

Hey,

Nice post, made me think alot.


I guess I view it like this. Time only exists or is made relative to human beings, because we have labeled this progression. Time is the product of the quantifying human mind and it is in this mind that it only truly exists.

From a Physics point of view, the thing we label as time is present in everything. Physics, is being able to prove by experiment a physical reaction or entity. And as we see this effect we call time in everything, we can postulate that it is in fact a entity that effects everything in our universe and everything that came before.

For example, you can not find C if you do not have time. You can not record the decay of atoms without time, etc.

Time itself is a broad meaning littered with other words like, moment, before, after, beginning and end. I think this is one of many points where philosophy and theory meet physics. I have always thought time to be the secret to everything and would love to be alive when we figure out exactly what time is, if it is made of something or is a product of a system. I once thought that time in our universe was the product of our two main universal forces that effect everything, dark energy and gravity. I thought that these two massive forces acting on matter in the universe gave us time, but it's just a theory of a curious youngster.


I still have those random thoughts as of lately, when i learned that we are all made up of strings resting on a brane and those strings make up everything in the universe just by vibrating in different frequencies, the fist thing came to mind that the universe is just a projection, like a big tv screen. Yes, it's crazy but I do like exploring thoughts like this.


Anyways I've prattled on enough, nice post I enjoyed it

tHx TIME! i try to think about it but its hard.

I still believe that everything happens at the same time and in the same place...
It just happens to be a long time and a big place!

Time is our constant transition outward from the Big Bang at the rate equal to the speed of light. The transition is in the time dimension. Time is as real as the existence of the Universe.

but that's in theme, 2000 zero zero,..............the Dow Jones Industrial averages have with the `Big Banks' been in decline from millennium 2000. Have a look at the DJI historic charts you oowls.

This post has been edited by vadgbottler on Mar 27 2010, 10:15 AM

I like the idea that we are travelling at the speed of light, as seen by an observer very very very far away.

Having(myself) a prejudice towards the concept of time, couldn't it be equally valid to say that- ...intrinsic kinetic motions and periodicity is slowed in the cases pertaining to SR and GR. And does that statement eliminate the need to conceptualize time as a universal construct and purport it as a human construct?

All known clock functions are mass force functions and since mass changes with velocity all clock functions slow with increasing velocity.

Time being a physical reality as a result of physical action has nothing to do with the observer. Time existed before any human observer and will go on when we are gone.

But mass and energy will (and/or might) cease to exist without observers? An observer being sentient being/machine, or any bit of mass?

It's said that time began at the creation point of the universe. If this is, then how did it begin?

Oh, the nothingness of 'nothing'! Don't you think that science has shown us either to be the case?

tHx AsTrO

The one thing that isn't really emphasized often enough about 'the big bang theory' is that it's not really a theory.

It's a set of predictions made by a theory.

That theory is general relativity.

I have a thought on the issue of before the big bang. It will be labelled crackpot though but i will put it out there.

For anyone that has read my other posts you will see where i get this idea.

Ok so all the blackholes in existence so far are travelling to the past not the future.

All the mass, matter, particles, photons etc that were sucked into the black holes are rematerialising at one point before the big bang creating a super mass, it then gets to certain point and once that threshold is passed - bang!

This is one big loop and happens over and over again.

If time travel were possible then its possible that the big bang is happening now as we speak but at an earlier time, but if i could travel back there now to see it it would have to be happening over and over again.
Thats also kinda going on my comments about reverse time dilation, BUT I KNOW HOW EVERYONE FEELS ABOUT THAT, i Know i will prob get similar comments about this.