Scientific Forums


 

Add reply Start new topic Start new poll


> Nasa Tether, Question
Meem
Posted: Jul 1 2009, 07:33 PM


Advanced Member
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 889
Joined: 6-June 09

Positive Feedback: 38.46%
Feedback Score: -49


Okay, so before class I was board and looking through some entertaining stuff, and watched a few youtubes about UFOs, which I posted in the sci-tech sub-forum. I'm not sure how accurate the information is which is presented in the beginning of the video, but if it's true at all ... would the silicon nanowire vs. the carbon not remedy the issue?

I would also have to imagine that perhaps solar cycle activity, spots/flares could be problematic for such a thing? Could there not be a secondary "skin" for the tether to provided as much shielding as possible to combat increased solar or cosmic ray activity, which could be adjusted accordingly? I don't know, when Ron mentioned the tether it made me think about the silicon nanowire stuff I have been fascinated with for some time. I think that is one avenue with pursuing heavily. We have all kinds of ways to generate power, it's always seemed to be the storage which was or has been a problem.

QUOTE
The tether lol
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=As-wYmFYb3I&feature=related

About the tether though ... and something mentioned about this incident, it had a large power surge that caused the incident ... I think mentioned something like a
2-10 fold increase of what was expected? What if they used nano-silicon structure for the conduit? You know, like the stuff this guy is working on,

http://news.stanford.edu/news/2008/january...ire-010908.html
QUOTE 
Stanford researchers have found a way to use silicon nanowires to reinvent the rechargeable lithium-ion batteries that power laptops, iPods, video cameras, cell phones, and countless other devices.

The new technology, developed through research led by Yi Cui, assistant professor of materials science and engineering, produces 10 times the amount of electricity of existing lithium-ion, known as Li-ion, batteries. A laptop that now runs on battery for two hours could operate for 20 hours, a boon to ocean-hopping business travelers.

"It's not a small improvement," Cui said. "It's a revolutionary development

Tether problem solved?


--------------------
"I would rather be a lucky fool than a deliberate one."
--- Meem ---
Top
Meem
Posted: Jul 2 2009, 05:29 PM


Advanced Member
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 889
Joined: 6-June 09

Positive Feedback: 38.46%
Feedback Score: -49


QUOTE
Hello, hello, hello
Is there anybody in there?
Just nod if you can hear me.
Is there anyone at home?


QUOTE
Come on, come on down,
I hear you're feeling down.
Well I can ease your pain,
Get you on your feet again.

Relax, relax, relax
I need some information first.
Just the basic facts.
Can you show me where it hurts?

There is no pain, you are receding.
A distant ship's smoke on the horizon.
You are only coming through in waves.
Your lips move, but I can't hear what you're saying.

When I was a child, I had a fever.
My hands felt just like two balloons.
Now I've got that feeling once again.
I can't explain, you would not understand.
This is not how I am.

I have become comfortably numb.


--------------------
"I would rather be a lucky fool than a deliberate one."
--- Meem ---
Top
Meem
Posted: Jul 3 2009, 10:27 PM


Advanced Member
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 889
Joined: 6-June 09

Positive Feedback: 38.46%
Feedback Score: -49


So, I'm gonna answer my own question I suppose. Yes, it does.

QUOTE
So, so you think you can tell Heaven from Hell,
blue skies from pain.
Can you tell a green field from a cold steel rail?
A smile from a veil?
Do you think you can tell?
And did they get you to trade your heroes for ghosts?
Hot ashes for trees?
Hot air for a cool breeze?
Cold comfort for change?
And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage?
How I wish, how I wish you were here.
We're just two lost souls swimming in a fish bowl, year after year,
Running over the same old ground.
What have you found? The same old fears.
Wish you were here.


--------------------
"I would rather be a lucky fool than a deliberate one."
--- Meem ---
Top
Ron
Posted: Jul 3 2009, 11:10 PM


One of the Grays
*****

Group: Power Member
Posts: 1365
Joined: 27-August 05

Positive Feedback: 87.06%
Feedback Score: 132


Hi Meem,
Sorry to interrupt your self-conversation! I've been trying to find any references to compare the 2 (Si or C nano-wires), but, from what I'm finding there is no direct comparisons for this type of application. Si seems to be used for electronics. This would make sense to me because Carbon nano-tubes are made for their tensile strength, where Si is more applicable to semi-conduction. You know that carbon crystal structure lends itself to strength because of the way they bond. And, in a nano-tube, that strength is increased greatly.
Also, you wouldn't have the problems like you saw with Si because carbon would be much less susceptible to surges because of it's higher electrical resistivity.
I've only looked into this briefly, but I just wanted to keep you from getting to good at talking to yourself!

On a side note, I watched a program on ancient structures and the ancient alien connections today. There is a site in Bolivia that I'd never heard of before that is extremely interesting. It appears that this megalithic site is as much as 17,000 yrs old and extremely sophisticated. The structures are not intact, but the individual blocks and the way they are cut is impressive. I'll try to find more on it.
Talk to ya later,
Ron
Top
Meem
Posted: Jul 4 2009, 12:08 AM


Advanced Member
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 889
Joined: 6-June 09

Positive Feedback: 38.46%
Feedback Score: -49


Heya Ron,

Maybe the pure Si would not work, the pure carbon seemed to have it's failure as well, maybe a "weave" of the two? A stiff and rigid crystalline structure seems to discount Green's ideas about flux. Run with me here, because I am not that mathematically literate. So I will try to get at what I ... "think" I am saying. Take the change in building mechanics in earth quake prone areas. Once all buildings had a solid foundation, and they still are solid but, today most are designed to have flux incorporated into the base structure. I would think in the tethers case, something would have to allow for flux all along it. If Si is not able to be used to help the situation and only carbon is applicable, it probably needs better shielding from cosmic rays, which can be adjusted to compensate for flux in cosmic rays.

(edit) is it possible to make a ... "carbon-silicon" polymer? Where's a chemist when you need one! OR whoever the molecular structure specialists are!
QUOTE
susceptible to surges because of it's higher electrical resistivity

I don't know, what about the role of capacity though? maybe the carbon wire could be wrapped around a silicon core, something like coaxial I suppose. Is that stupid? I know that's a loaded question around these parts but, honesty over pride wink.gif

I'll have to look that about this structure in Bolivia, though it sort of sounds familiar already. I think maybe a while ago, I can vaguely remember something about really old stones and the speculations on how they could have been cut.

(p.s.) what kind of person doesn't like to hear Pink Floyd, even if they "overhear" someone "singing it in the shower?" laugh.gif

Later on,
Paul.

This post has been edited by Meem on Jul 4 2009, 12:23 AM


--------------------
"I would rather be a lucky fool than a deliberate one."
--- Meem ---
Top
Ron
Posted: Jul 5 2009, 01:10 AM


One of the Grays
*****

Group: Power Member
Posts: 1365
Joined: 27-August 05

Positive Feedback: 87.06%
Feedback Score: 132


HI Paul,
Have you ever heard Les Claypool do the entire Animals album (with the 'fearless flying frog brigade')? You must listen to it, especially if you like The Colonel!
As far as Carbon non-tubes go, you really need to see the structure. If you think about how carbon locks together (think of carbonizing Iron to make steel), You'll see that it's structure is perfect for making very strong bonds with itself.
I'm not great at chemistry, but I know electronics, and what I know of Si compound, they can be extremely brittle. I'm not really sure why you don't like the idea of a pure carbon nano-tube. Check out some of the research. It's quite far along.
Peace,
Ron
Top
Meem
Posted: Jul 5 2009, 01:27 AM


Advanced Member
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 889
Joined: 6-June 09

Positive Feedback: 38.46%
Feedback Score: -49


According to some of the information on this Stanford work, it doesn't seem to be very brittle, at least that was the impression I had. lol the link was dead ... wierd.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/...71219103105.htm
QUOTE
Silicon placed in a battery swells as it absorbs positively charged lithium atoms during charging, then shrinks during use (i.e., when playing your iPod) as the lithium is drawn out of the silicon. This expand/shrink cycle typically causes the silicon (often in the form of particles or a thin film) to pulverize, degrading the performance of the battery.
Cui's battery gets around this problem with nanotechnology. The lithium is stored in a forest of tiny silicon nanowires, each with a diameter one-thousandth the thickness of a sheet of paper. The nanowires inflate four times their normal size as they soak up lithium. But, unlike other silicon shapes, they do not fracture. Research on silicon in batteries began three decades ago. Candace Chan, a graduate student of Cui, explained: "The people kind of gave up on it because the capacity wasn't high enough and the cycle life wasn't good enough. And it was just because of the shape they were using. It was just too big, and they couldn't undergo the volume changes."

Then, along came silicon nanowires. "We just kind of put them together," Chan said.

For their experiments, Chan grew the nanowires on a stainless steel substrate, providing an excellent electrical connection. "It was a fantastic moment when Candace told me it was working," Cui said.

Cui said that a patent application has been filed. He is considering formation of a company or an agreement with a battery manufacturer. Manufacturing the nanowire batteries would require "one or two different steps, but the process can certainly be scaled up," he added. "It's a well understood process."

The breakthrough is described in detail in a paper, "High-performance lithium battery anodes using silicon nanowires," published online Dec. 16 in Nature Nanotechnology, written by Cui, his graduate chemistry student Candace Chan and five others.

Also contributing to the paper in Nature Nanotechnology were Halin Peng and Robert A. Huggins of Materials Science and Engineering at Stanford, Gao Liu of Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory, and Kevin McIlwrath and Xiao Feng Zhang of the electron microscope division of Hitachi High Technologies in Pleasanton, Calif.


I mean .. this stuff sounds like the answer to a lot of problems. I don't know. Very interesting stuff. I think all the money for "drill-here, drill-now" should be going to this, get us off that middle east teet, and let them make "blood money" somewhere else. Off topic, I am so glad that Palin quit. If she runs in 2012, I will be moving to Germany and work for my wife's uncle or something. Faster than you can say, "You betcha."

This post has been edited by Meem on Jul 5 2009, 01:38 AM


--------------------
"I would rather be a lucky fool than a deliberate one."
--- Meem ---
Top
Enthalpy
Posted: Aug 5 2009, 05:09 PM


Slick member
*****

Group: Power Member
Posts: 1504
Joined: 9-May 07

Positive Feedback: 70.73%
Feedback Score: 39


Pure single-crystalline silicon, even in bulk form, has a fabulous yield strength combined with a low density BUT is not used in mechanical applications because it is so brittle. To my knowledge, nobody has achieved an alloy nor anything that keeps silicon's strength and makes it tough.

Combining silicon with carbon is a working solution. At least two ways are used commonly:

SiC is a ceramic, very stable against heat and chemical agents, very strong in compression, but still a bit brittle. It is used mainly as an abrasive, but gets usable for mechanical parts if included as a powder in a metal: search for "Metal Matrix Ceramic" or Cermet.

Silicon is poured (mp~+1400C) on carbon fibres. Their interface is excellent because it builds the stable SiC, so the composite of carbon fibres and silicon matrix doesn't delaminate. I played with some: they are light, hard, very strong in compression but not magic in tension nor bending. Used as brakes (Porsche) against metal for low-wear, high-temp, low dilation, and good friction coefficient when cold.
Top
Capracus
Posted: Dec 20 2012, 12:07 PM


Advanced Member
*****

Group: Power Member
Posts: 5374
Joined: 5-October 06

Positive Feedback: 75.56%
Feedback Score: 41


Top
Capracus
Posted: Jun 28 2013, 03:20 AM


Advanced Member
*****

Group: Power Member
Posts: 5374
Joined: 5-October 06

Positive Feedback: 75.56%
Feedback Score: 41


Top
Capracus
Posted: Jul 25 2013, 10:38 AM


Advanced Member
*****

Group: Power Member
Posts: 5374
Joined: 5-October 06

Positive Feedback: 75.56%
Feedback Score: 41


Now, device to help clean up space junk
http://truthdive.com/2013/07/24/Now-device...space-junk.html
Top
Capracus
Posted: Aug 24 2013, 07:54 AM


Advanced Member
*****

Group: Power Member
Posts: 5374
Joined: 5-October 06

Positive Feedback: 75.56%
Feedback Score: 41


A New Space Propulsion Concept - A One-Kilometer-Long Electric Sail Tether Produced!
http://www.messagetoeagle.com/solarwindsail.php#.Uhhl139hvMo
Top
Capracus
Posted: Aug 27 2013, 09:10 AM


Advanced Member
*****

Group: Power Member
Posts: 5374
Joined: 5-October 06

Positive Feedback: 75.56%
Feedback Score: 41


Space Elevators On Hold At Least Until Stronger Materials Are Available, Experts Say
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/29/s..._n_3353697.html

This post has been edited by Capracus on Aug 27 2013, 09:11 AM
Top

Topic Options

Add reply Start new topic Start new poll


 

Terms of use