The Magnetic Ghost Machine, a free idea for the brave

Looks intriguing, I'll admit. I think the issue will be with structure. There is no way to tell where the object is with respect to the field source. Anything breaking the flux line along the whole flux line path will have the same effect.

But, I'm actually surprised to see what you are showing.

MeBigGuy, I think he might be able to set up an array of these, or move it's position to take a number of readings, like an MRI and get good 3d image. Unless, that is, I'm misunderstanding something.

Templeghost, two things.
1: You're gonna wind up with a before all is said and done... I'd buy one.
2: Mind if I quote you elsewhere in this forum?

(I found this article when looking for that image. Nifty, t'aint it? )

@BDW

Read my previous posts in this thread.

I question whether a magnetic vector implies a single lobed magnetic field. It's not the same as using phased antenna arrays to focus RF fields. I supplied him with references to calculate the actual off axis fields, but they were not trivial calculations.

But, the scope traces look interesting. I question how many positions would cause the same image, and whether those ambiguities are all resolvable by an array of 8 devices.

As I think more about it, I'd expect what he is showing at one side or the other, but I wouldn't expect a smooth transition between.

This can actually be studied in a more meaningful way by using a pickup coil within the target area. Or, by measuring force on an object within the target area.

Time will tell.

I tend to agree, but I am no expert on electromagnetism. You, however, seem to know the subject quite well, which makes me glad I agree. I do have doubts (about our doubts ) though. Perhaps he could augment the imaging abilities with an array of magnetic switches? if you don't know to what I am referring, I mean a small (1-2mm) plastic container with a pressure switch on all four sides, and a small metal ball inside. (please forgive my naivete, it's an idea based on something I built with a toys-r-us electrical set when I was a child. Only mine was bigger than 2mm, more like 2 inches, but I think a 2mm version could be built, easily enough.) this might be able to read the perturbations (right word?) in the magnetic field generated by the device, and distorted by the object being scanned. This would give an additional image with a resolution equal to the grid size of the array, and if he builds a working model, he might be able to secure funding to build such an array with much much higher resolution. (I picture the array as Once again, I'm no expert. Feel free to correct any mistaken assumptions I have made.

Now that's a good idea. TempleGhost, you should try that, see what kind of perturbations you can get. Can't hurt, and it might help you notice bugs and small variations easier than just using your arm (or finger.)
Also, have you submitted your design to your local patent office yet? I'd hate to see some faceless corporation with a huge R&D budget profit from your hard work whilst you labor in obscurity...

I feel a little arrogant, jumping into a discussion between two people who obviously know more than I about the subject, but I can't help it. It's too interesting.

I have been reading this book about Tesla lately, and this device somehow sounds similar to the sort of things he was doing. Does it relate in any way to anything he tried to do? This is no criticism, I am just curious. He seemed to inspire inventions over 100 years later.

Don't let happen to you what happened to him. He got robbed and ripped off alot. Rush to that patent office. Quick!

That is a familiar image! How many times I watched the crew of the Enterprise land on some planet and use that to "see." Templeghost, do you think yours will ever be small enough to be handheld like that?

Templeghost, I have the distinct feeling you are one who knows a lot about all things electrical/magnetic. Speaking of fields that can be felt or used, I was reading just recently that Tesla had lights he made that he was using in his own lab that did not have to be plugged in. They drew their energy from a field he had all throughout the room. They were glass tubes with some sort of gas that could lite when a field was present. That sounds rather cool. Can you buy these today? It sounds like it would be great for an outdoor party where you do not want people tripping over wires in the grass. There is some device giving off the field and lots of individual lights sitting on tables, etc., possibly glowing exotic colors.

Templeghost, if your device came to market, what could I use it for? What could I see with it?

In the case of this system, just pushing the object being scanned through the scanning ring automatically creates 3D data, with each new frame being a 2-dimensional cross section of the 3-D shape. So it should be quite easy to build 3D views from the output video. As for qouting me, of course I don't mind. I might not always be right though!

It moves along with the object being scanned, without fail. I should be specific here, in order to create a simple waveform such as this, I set the y variable to zero in order to continually scan across the x-axis, this way the waveform is much easier to view on an oscilloscope. No need to do this when viewing full frame video though.

The closest thing I can think of is neon signs, they power them up with lots of voltage in order to make the neon glow. In the case of tesla using magnetic fields to do it, wow, he would need a ton of magnetic field strength, although some of the modern work on wireless and resonant magnetic fields could certainly help with this, there's nothing like that available that I am aware of.

Great question, I wish I knew, hehehe. In a classical sense, it should show pictures of magnetic permeability. Every element has a slightly different permeability, and as such a high power, high resolution system could show every element, molecule or neurotransmitter as a different color. More generally, my prototype is scanning much like a television, in order to display realtime video.

Imagine you could pick up the pole of a magnet and move it through the body in order to sense the output at each point, in many respects, this is exactly what the system is doing. Further to this, unlike other scanning techniques, this system is very sensitive to phase, and electronic structure, and should be very adept at showing the transition metals, and all manner of ionic interactions within the body.

Who knows? Maybe we are all arrayed with the Holy Spirit and there is a magnetic vector universe waiting to be discovered. That is what I like to think.

OooooOoOooooOoh... You're doing some inventing man, let's not get religion involved. (it smacks of crankery) No offense intended, it's just that that phrase rubbed me wrong... Unless of course, you meant that jokingly.

Really? I have trouble imagining that happening, it seems like the shape should break up or distort as it moves. But what do I know? Got a video camera? Think you could video tape that bit for us curious onlookers?

I keep wondering if maybe you could build a half-circle version somehow. I have no patience (and little expertise) to sit here and figure out whether you could, but I wonder...
Keep posting details, man

This post has been edited by BigDumbWeirdo on Nov 14 2007, 03:17 AM

"He continued on around the block....With a sigh, he turned and walked toward his laboratory at 33-35 South Fifth Avenue (now West Broadway), near Bleecker Street.

Entering the familiar loft building in the darkness, he closed a master switch. Tube lighting on the walls sprang into brilliance, illuminating a shadowy cavern filled with weirdly shaped machinery. The strange thing about about this tube lighting was that it had no connections to the loops of electrical wiring around the ceiling. Indeed, it had no connections at all, drawing all its energy from the ambient force field. He could pick up an unattached light and move it freely to any part of the workshop." p. 20-21, TESLA: MAN OUT OF TIME by Margaret Cheney.

He must have had a lot of juice in that place.

I just saw a movie I got on DVD just a few days ago called "The Core." In the story, the earth's magnetic field quit. People went down in a ship that could blast its way through the earth to its core. They were going to set off nukes a certain way to get the flow going down deep in the earth to kick start the magnetic field back. The ship had a device that could see through rock and molten rock as they went down. Different colors indicated different substances and densities. That sounds sort of like your device. Did you see that movie?

You are quite right actually, it does distort it somewhat. My humble prototype is only able to resolve a relatively low res, but this shouldn't be an issue with 10 or 12 bit D/A convertors, and more magnetic field strength would help as well.

To the videotaping, absolutely. I am so close to having the entire system running now, I just need to take a journey for a few days to get some parts. I already have a video recorder setup such that I can record full screen video output. I don't have a camcorder, but the real output should be on the way, fingers crossed.

I raced off to do something, but while I was away I was thinking about something from my college days. One of the teachers said that if you take a flourescent tube outside on a dark night, and find some high voltage wires, if you hold it up while running under them you can get it to light up a little bit. I did happen to catch that movie a while back, cores, and magnetic fields eh?

Ahh well, I am ready for bed, and I may disappear for a little while to take care of some things and do some shopping around, but I will come back with some updates as soon as I can.

Where I am staying there aren't any good electronic supply stores so I packed my bag and went off on a journey. First off, I travelled to the nearest 'city' which is a little place named after a rock. While I was waiting for my coach I went off for some lunch. It was a lovely day so I went out the back, and was eating my sandwich, when I spotted the upcoming movie which was staring at me, Golden Compass.



When I grow tired, little signs like this give me a smile. In the middle of my travels I caught some buses up to the electronics area in Toronto. On my way I passed where I used to live, and I had a little chuckle at the name of the local mall, otherwise known at CenterPoint. When I first built my scanner I worked for a pool table manufacturer known as CenterSpot. It's just too funny!



Anyway, I had a big list of parts and did a bunch of shopping. For my video amp I decided to go with MAR-4 amplifiers. These little things have 50 ohm input and ouput impedance and offer around 8db gain per stage. With a good ground plane they perform really well, and I can cascade them to get the output voltage I require.

Along with amplifier parts, I needed a new genlock to sync all my computers. In my last round of testing the old PC power supply I was using finally gave up the ghost, and fried my genlock board amongst other things. I still had some empty genlock circuits, so I got some 74241 buffer chips, along with the various connectors and built a new genlock. Here is a pic of my overall setup:



I originally did all this work back in 1999, so it has been a real challenge, but lots of fun, putting it all back together again. I have just finished putting together all the latest circuits and here you can see all the amplifier boards. The little genlock plugs in at the left, and you can see a ribbon cable connects it to the master sync computer. The amps plug into each other, and carry the sync signals to all the other computers which are running in parallel.



Welcome to my wiring nightmare, hehehe. For the sake of simple testing, I am running just four transmitters in this setup. In order to adjust my transmitter amps, and the output amp, I lock the second channel of my oscilloscope to the master sync waveform so I can see a stable version of the output waveform:



So, that's where I am at currently. The amp is working well and multiplies the voltage around 3 times for each stage. It looks like 3 or 4 stages will give a nice output signal. Theory says I should have a capacitor of around 12pF in parallel with my receiver coils, but I am still playing around with this, and the grounding.

Just yesterday I used a simple diode circuit to lay my output voltage onto my composite video, and it all seems pretty solid. So, here I go, I have to throw in some new agnus chips into my old amiga motherboards, and adjust the software a little bit to help the bootup situation.

But right now, my head needs a rest.....

Yesterday I noticed some very interesting information regarding magnetic monopoles. Particulalry, that they may not appear as elementary 'systems' but rather as emergent particles, in a strongly interacting many-body system.

magnetic monopoles in spin ice

Over the holidays I have taken a break from my work, but perhaps I have some new incentive with these developments. Are there any very smart people who could help apply their mathematical approach to emergent magnetic monopoles to the geometry of my scanner?



This post has been edited by templeghost on Jan 5 2008, 12:38 AM

You are most probably closer to the truth than what you realize.

Hi Neo, have you ever taken a moment to look back on the things you write and think in order to consider the spirit of what you were saying?

In some cases, perhaps we are talking to ourselves. Consider the points I have been making from the very start of this thread, was I always suggesting the nature of the system I am presenting?

In retrospect, it seems very obvious. Surely the soul and the spirit thereof is always telling us the truth, and trying to help us find our way. No doubt our fate will find a way.

Very good.... Very god indeedie! It reminds me of the Greek Spiral... are they related?