Very Affraid By Ivan Gorelik's Theory On Lhc

To be honest, I dont know anything regarding physics apart of elementary things that you can read/watch at discovery, but for sure I am scared like hell of an eventual poosibility of something disastrous.

I had my day ruined when I heard about that LHC starting again in Nov or was it Dec 2009 ? So I landed on your forums here and see that the same old pysicists that destroyed the theories from 2008 are still kickin in and for this I am glad, seriously I am. There are here several "beautifull minds" and for this I am thankful.

http://scienceblogs.com/startswithabang/20..._is_the_lhc.php

Dear people!

Your life, your children’s lives are in your hands.

Humans, like a herd of obedient sheep, are lead to the last abyss. I, as a mortally frightened lamb, run from side to side of the herd, but the herd do not hear me. They laugh at me and moves slowly, plucking the juicy grass.

People, please, wake up! Open your eyes!

November the 30-th, according to the preliminary plan for the Large Hadron Collider, the collision of protons with energies of 0.45 TeV will be implemented, 14 December - collision with energies of 3.5 TeV. If the magnetic collapse starts, it will be impossible to stop it. It will end with ejection of the Earth’s shell into space.

I give the following probabilities:
10% that magnetic collapse will start at 0.45 TeV;
50% at 3.5 TeV;
70% at 7 TeV.
30% I leave to my mistake.

In order to save your lives you must plead your presidents to barn the high-energy experiments in physics.
Here is an Internet address of Russian President http://letters.kremlin.ru/
Can you give me an Internet address of your President?

In order to save your lives you must ask the Head of your country’s Prosecutor’s Office to open the criminal cases against the authors of articles about risk assessment of safety of colliders, because these authors had made there several crude errors, lie and false statements.
Here is an Internet address of Russian Prosecutor’s Office http://www.genproc.gov.ru/ipriem/address/
Can you give me an Internet address of your country’s Prosecutors Office?

Here are the main their errors:
1. Equating of consequences of collider particle collisions with collisions of cosmic and atmospheric particles.
2. The computation of the number of destructed protons by hypothetical magnetic monopole.
3. The silent assumption that magnetic monopole does not grow.

Their crime lie is hidden in the statement that stars and planets do not explode. We can see novae and supernovae. We do not know what happened to Phaeton.

My opponents on this and other forums did not give any solid argument that magnetic hole is impossible. Their arguments were aimed, first of all, at bad hints of my person. But those are not the scientific arguments.

Links:
Two independent coinciding math computations of magnetic hole: --
Not completed list of proving arguments: --
List of errors made in the risk assessment of safety of powerful colliders: --

[Moderator: Suspended 10 days for posting no useful information or asking any valid questions.]

[Moderator: Suspended 30 days -- all self-published URLs deleted.]

This post has been edited by rpenner on Nov 26 2009, 06:19 AM

Ivan... I thought you were banned...

Anyway... there are already a number of legal challenges to the LHC. The US one led by Walter Wagner was dismissed not long ago and the European group LHC Kritik tried in their own countries but their demands for an injunction were dismissed as well... though they can continue to try further if they wish.

LHC Kritik

It really does not look like the courts are ever going to stop the LHC.

However...

I have a suggestion for you. Hopefully I am not breaking any rules here.

I am well known as being a supporter of the LHC and I have had some correspondence with people who work there. If you send me $50 000 dollars (American), I will go to Switzerland and do as much as I can to stop the LHC from starting up. Admittedly I am only one person but I am fairly good at public speaking and might make a difference.

Let's face it... if you are so sure you are going to die... what is your money good for anyway?

Send it to me and maybe get one more small chance at stopping it.

I am mostly curious as to what you are prepared to do to stop the LHC other than trying to pass off your theory as correct by latching on to public fears of the LHC.

Put your money where your mouth is.


(Edited to add... maybe it would be even more effective if you passed the same amount around to a few others... maybe Rpenner, Alphanumeric and MjolnirPants come to mind. I can't speak for them of course. Quadruple the cost.. but at least 30 times the effect I am sure.

Just looking out for you guys )

This post has been edited by RobDegraves on Oct 16 2009, 05:54 AM

'Dr' Wolf (or shall I say sheep), you are the most appalling piece of crap that I've ever met online.
I truly understand, that you must have had a hard time in high-school, but since some decades, we have therapies for that. Please shut up, and stop causing harm to innocent people, you sorry ana* fucke*..

I would require at least $250,000US, but I would be willing to spew some false diatribe for that amount. I am rather good at public speaking, so long as I manage to conjure up the image of a naked audience, first...

Damn... I'm a bargain then. I feel so cheap now. Anyway... we word is my bond... send me a tell or respond here and I will get you instructions on where to send your money so I can get it. Remember.. your money is really worth nothing to you if you really believe we are all going to die. It's a bargain in that case isn't it?

Hey Rob, you frightened little devout nerd-worshipper, why don't you try to get control over your own fear, and let people who are at least honest about their fear, alone. Just ignore their comments, leave 'm alone!

You shouldn't feel cheap. I am currently unemployed (except as a stay-at-home dad), and living off of the money I'd set aside for this day, so my higher prices merely reflect a greater need for money. I can't afford to prepare for such actions on my own, let alone the travel costs involved.

Besides, I really could use the money as a down payment on a house. I'm thinking a nice, ranch style house somewhere in a small town in the Midwest, or southwest Canada...

Actually I am a Nerd-Agnostic.


If you want to be left alone with your fear, just don't read these posts. I can suggest a whole rack of websites that will give you even more fake reasons to be afraid, not to mention all the real reasons to be afraid that are creeping around out there... like clowns....

Rob, let me state here firmly that I'm not afraid, but that I am blessed with a very strong empathy, that I use, not only to understand suffering people, but also to protect myself from people who are 'on the wrong track'. Understand?

[Moderator: Suspended 10 days for posting no useful information or asking any valid questions.]

This post has been edited by rpenner on Oct 17 2009, 07:52 AM

If you're going to sockpuppet, don't make it so obvious.

According to this article from last year, a new particle was discvered at Tevatron. The scientist agreed that they didnt expected the whole thing. I quote:

The fact that the Large Hadron Collider is shut down until next year doesn't mean that discoveries in the field of quantum particle physics aren't deployed anymore. As such, researchers operating the old Tevatron device from the American Fermilab laboratory in Batavia (Illinois) stumbled upon a strange new particle last week, which they cannot explain through the means of the standard model of physics.

The Collider Detector from Fermilab (CDF) is especially designed in order to detect the outcome of the accelerated collision between protons and anti-protons taking place inside the 1.5-centimeter wide "beam pipe" of the Tevatron device. The resulting particles are monitored by means of a large amount of surrounding electronic apparatus. Last week, CDF was tracking the aftermath of a collision between bottom quarks and bottom anti-quarks that should have normally decayed into at least a pair of muons (charged particles).


The first shock came when the scientists detected a larger number of muons than previously anticipated and the second and even larger one involved the formation of muons outside of the pipe, leaving no trace in the detector's inner layer. The team is eluded by this effect and admits that it cannot be explained by regular physics, although they don't dismiss the possibility of a mundane accident having generated it. Other researchers state this means that an unknown particle with a nearly 20-picosecond lifespan was generated, traveled for about 1 centimeter through the beam pipe, and eventually decayed into muons.



According to Dan Hooper from Fermilab, "A centimeter is a long way for most kinds of particles to make it before decaying. It's too early to say much about this. That being said, if it turns out that a new 'long-lived' particle exists, it would be a very big deal". But this newly-discovered particle is very similar to a model proposed by Neal Weiner from New York University and Nima Arkani-Hamed from the Institute for Advanced Study in Princeton about the behavior of dark matter particles, although nobody cares to venture a firm opinion on this.



But even if the link is ultimately ruled out, the discovery of this kind of particle and of its strange behavior still remains an important breakthrough which may determine scientists to investigate the limits of physics, or better yet, of their knowledge of it. As always in such cases, perhaps time will tell.



For me, (as an outsider of serious physics) it looks beyond suspicious and brings again the question the safety of such experiments. We have a new particle that none knows what was or is, that had a huge lifespan compared to what conventional physics provided. This could show that we lack serious information around this issue. And given that the Tevatron cant go over 2 TeV, one can only imagine that things even more out of place and order could appear with a LHC running at much greater energies.

Now my question for Alphanumeric and the other gods of physics around, can you please explain what happened there ? Please dont mind my extremely lack of information outside this article - which I honestly approve that troubled my mind, nor the english spelling (not my native language).

Well.. I don't really know what the particle was.. or even if it was at all....

However...

I think I can prove fairly succinctly why the LHC is not a danger, from a pure logic standpoint rather than a physics standpoint.

1. Axiom... Scientists don't know everything.

2. Axiom... Scientists do know some things.

I think we can all agree there.


Subsequently...

Only two theories predict the possibility of black holes being created. Relativity and the "Extra Large Extra Dimensions" theory.

1. Relativity

The original black hole theory. However, it requires that an accelerator be about the size of the solar system in order to reach the energies required to make one.

If that theory is wrong..then you don't have that theory predicting black holes either.

2. Extra Large Extra Dimensions

This theory is derived from string theory, which itself is derived from quantum mechanics. If, and it's a big if, quantum mechanics is wrong in any way.. then this theory is based on nothing and you don't get black holes. If quantum mechanics is right.. you might get black holes if every part of the structure is correct, but those black holes can't harm anyone.


Also...

There is always the argument that any new experiment like the LHC has the potential to show us that everything we know is wrong or that there is something we don't know of that could show up and destroy us all.

That is true.

However.. that is also true of every possible new experiment. When man first harnessed fire, he could not possibly have known that it would not anger the Gods who would then have destroyed them all. Or that fire wasn't a malign entity just waiting for their guard to be down. What about new medicines... which could generate a virus that destroys us all.

If you are going to argue that we don't know everything and thus should stop experimenting... you stop all progress forever.

Where is this article from? It could be genuine but there are alarm bells ringing in the second paragraph - it states that the tevatron looks at collisions of protons and anti protons but then comes up with this: "CDF was tracking the aftermath of a collision between bottom quarks and bottom anti-quarks..." This is simply not possible in the tevatron.

I believe it's also possible to form bound states of particles that are pretty long lived that decay into muons. A bottom and and anti-bottom form what's called bottomonium (stop the sniggering, you at the back) which I believe can travel a reasonable distance before it decays. Whether it can travel 1 cm or more, I don't know.