Can it be shown that infrasound has a magnetic component? The premise is that mass moving through a gravitational field creates (gravitational magnetism) gravitomagnetism.

The experiment is creating a permanent magnet using a material very susceptible to magnetization, heating it close to its melting point and then applying a continuous blast of infrasound with significant power until the material cools to ambient temperature or is quenched in water.

If magnetization occurs that is significantly stronger than what would be expected at that location for the Earth's magnetic field then a link may be shown as described above. In this thought experiment rotation is substituted with the application of infrasound.

A validation of this experiement would shed significant light into votices created by thunderstorms as well as a myriad of other anomalies. It may be the key many are looking for.

Tom

What is infrasound? Legitimate question seeking answer, please.

Warning! Other thoughts, that relate poorly to the subject, follow...

Maybe gravity is at the cause of all forces. I remain unsure how that could be but I will explore the idea over much time.

The Earth has an overall gravity which attracts planets. The core moves at a different speed to the crust and is mass moving in relation to mass so this may be mostly the generator of our magnetosphere. Could the overall movement of gravity in relation to other gravity cause a magnetic effect and therefore be put into a (very complex) equation.

Would this magnetic effect then be the overall difference in all the gravities of an object (such as for the entire Earth) moving in relation to each other? So while the Earth has a centre of gravity could it also has a relative movement of gravity which would repel/attract the relative gravity movement of other planets/photons/etc.

Or is this complete nonsense as gravity is only expressable as a direct force?

The nonsense this would allow the suggestion of is the notion of antigravity I guess. If you somehow spin gravity (or anitmatter) in a way to repel the Earth's moving gravity then you would have anti-gravity. The magnetic effect is so much less than the effect of the centre of gravity that the co-ordinated counter spin would have to be at an incredible velocity if this had any correctness.

Could be nonsense but I have to explore the notion of a relationship between gravity movement and magnetism at least as far as I can...

At this point in time gravitational magnetism (others) and/or gravitomagnetism in (GR) are only theories.

The premise that a mass moving through a gravitational field creates gravitational magnetism is speculative.

The thought experiment using infrasound in lieu of rotation may be one way to show this relationship.

Infrasound is sound below normal hearing range of 20hz that occurs in nature such as earthquakes, thunderstorms, Northern Lights, meteor showeres, wave action, wind, etc. Infrasound is a topic of great interest to researchers. Infrasound has special and unique characteristics not found in other sound ranges.

There are physiological effects of infrasound on the human body that are not understood. My thought is that if infrasound has a very subtle magnetic component to it, some of these anomalies may be explained especially in understanding the dynamics of thunderstorms that create vortices, lightning discharges, and lately in the news, gamma ray release.

Tom

?? I always thought that a mass moving through a gravitational field generates a flow of time... was I mistaken? Or did I merely have it backwards?

Sound, regardless of the frequency (infra, ultra, etc.) is medium dependent (air, water, etc.). So, no.

You cant couple the two. If the medium through which the sound is passing is magnetic, then the medium may reflect a change in magnetic moment, but it would again be medium specific and it would be because the acoustic energy you're supplying to the medium would be changing either the crystalline structure (by vibrating it) or deforming it (like a paramagnetic soft tissue).

Here is an interesting discussion on gravitomagnetism from two schools of perspective:

http://physics.ucsd.edu/~emichels/Gravitomagnetism.ppt

If sound can or may change the magnetic moment of a non magnetized material- using the thought experiment described above where no electromagnetism is introduced, what would be the maximum expected limit of magnetic field strength be?

Do you know if anyone has performed such an experiment using infrasound, desired material and heat in creating a permanent magnet?

If an anomaly in magnetic field strength was found, what would that indicate?

Tom

My thought is that the link between infrasound and gravitomagnetism may be that when infrasound is created by natural or manmade events, this is the tell in the sound medium that a maximum value (peak value) of a gravitomagnetic field has been achieved by the moving/vibrating object. An analogy is when a magnetic force is maximized when the charge's velocity and magnetic field are at a 90 degree angle.

Following this line of reasoning, applying infrasonsic frequencies as discussed in the thought experiment, may show a magnetic anomaly in the created permanent magnet if its magnetic field exceeds that expected for the Earth's magnetic field.

Tom

Hi Tom,

I think I see your point - but we must remember what sound really is.

It is merely a displacement of material, it is local pressure gradients within that material.

Generally, we consider it to be a sequence of shock-wave compressions along a coupled chain of material. Literally, the atoms of that material move toward, then away from each other.

Electrons are part of that motion, hence a local change in electric current, hence a local change in B, hence an "inductance" in nearby material (and a likewise impedance is returned).

Consider your infrasound experiment along a straight copper trace to see my point.

So, does infrasound have a magnetic componant? No, I'd suggest that any "magnetic" impact is merely a side-effect of the material being moved. While accoustic compressions might provide a novel method of creating that motion, that's all it'd be - a method of causing motion.

Hello Steve,

If gravitational magnetism (gravitomagnetism) exists, the hope is that it may be detected in other ways aside from elaborate experiments in space looking for a twist in space time. One of the prime obstacles is that gravitational magnetism is thought to be extremely weak, well outside of current detection strategies to monitor.

Outside of looking for precession and a wobble in the gravity probe B's gyroscopes, is there another method to infer this relationship? One possibility is to consider gravity a field of force instead of a wave. Here movement through a gravity field may create gravitomagnetism. I am interchanging the words gravitational magnetism and gravitomagnetism and this in itself is controversial since gravitational magnetism is not considered part of GR and gravitomagnetism is.

The bottom line premise to my thought experiments is the movement of mass through a gravitational field even if it is just moving atoms around smartly.


I understand that a sound wave does not have a magnetic component but it may have a relationship. My first post was off the mark here. If I am uderstanding your thoughts on this subject, if infrasound had any relationship at all with magnetism then simply bombarding copper wire with infrasound should induce a significant current , even if it was a significant micro electrical current.

We know that swinging a copper wire around in the air will induce a micro current because it is moving through the Earth's magnetic field. My original thought experiment using rotation, heat and spin was a modification of an ancient Chinese method of making magnetic compass needles. Here simply pounding the hot iron needle in a North-South orientation and quenching the metal afterwards did the trick.

The thought experiment was to substitute rotation for the pounding and determine if the resultant permanent magnet showed an anomaly in field strength.

The current thought experient is substituting spin with infrasound and the possibility that it could have a link to gravitomagnetism. I chose infrasound because of its unique characteristics and the effects reported in natural events such as earthquakes, tornadoes, meteor showers and on the human physiological system- especially emotions. The later piqued my interest since my thought is that a subtle magnetism affects emotions or conversely emotions have a subtle magnetic component to them. My thought is that infrasound may be the correct frequency to maximize and display an anomaly indicating the presence of gravitomagnetism in operation.

So Steve, your comments gives another twist- no pun intended- to the thought experiment. Let's drop creating a magnet and try to induce a micro electric current in copper wire using infrasound. My thought is using infrasonic pulses- kind of a doppler effect- on the copper wire to determine if the micro current created displays an anomaly greater than what one would expect rotating a copper wire through the Earth's magnetic field.

Tom

Thanks Tom, but let me be clear as to the challenge.

The copper trace is not a magnet, obviously - I chose it for this reason. However - any time two Cu atoms move in relation to each other, their electrons are moving as well - producing a (albiet small) current flow. An accoustic (physical) vibration - is simple motion of those atoms. My fear is that your experiment would simply yield a method of creating a very, very poor microphone... if I'm making any sense. Think about how the old D15 mics work, or even modern electrets, and you'll see what I mean. Also consider piezo-electric devices, like the things we'd use to light a barbeque grill.

Hello Steve,

My sense is making a microphone will not validate the thought experiment.

Interesting you mentioned this as I was reading how a guy was sharing how to put together a "frugal inventor" kind of infrasound receiver using a vintage speaker from a discarded stereo system, amp and oscilliscope. The goal was to make the speaker act as a microphone to detect the infrasound waves.

However, microphones perhaps could be incorporated in a further refinement of the thought experiment using infrasound. Again, we are looking for that anomaly, small as it may be, that infers gravitomagnetism. The Doppler Effect has been pretty well studied in sound wave propagation. Can infrasound be used to create a doppler effect? If one were looking for an anomaly in the doppler effect using infrasound that inferred gravitomagnetism what would that look like?

Here is the revised thought experiment:

Alluding to the statement that maximizing magnetic force when a charge's velocity and magnetic field are at a 90 degree angle, would a source traveling at a constant velocity emitting infrasound show an increase in the force of the wave front moving in similar fashion and less at other angles with respect to the Earth (verticle, ascending or horizontal transverse).

Tom

Tom,

I dont fully understand your connection between infrasound and gravitomagnetism, but I can add some things to your question - "Can it be shown that infrasound has a magnetic component?"

The easy start is - does it matter?
If sound waves can create change in position of magnetic field lines, then it wouldn't need a magnetic component.

It doesn't have a magnetic component, but does cause B field shifts (oscillations).
Then you've got charge potential, and pressure variations; and some kind of microphone to detect this.

A ribbon microphone detects vibrations of a conductor in a magnetic field..
is that what you want?

Do you have a specific frequency in mind?

TRoc

TRoc

You're right - infrasound (or any sound) does not have a magnetic component, per se. Sound is medium dependent. Infrasound, particularly may not even have enough energy to vibrate, say, a crystal lattice.

When you get acoustic energies bordering onto the very high end inside a crystal lattice, you get phonons (to which Steve seems to be alluding above). Phonons (either acoustic or optical) are quasiparticles have quantum properties and can, when of the right energy, couple to the lattice and travel either ballistically or deflect. If your phonon is high enough in energy, it will reach the infrared spectrum as phonons are just that (quantized packets of thermal energy quantified as hf), and will have a detectable B-field, since light is E x B.

If the crystal has a magnetic moment (some high-spin transition metal, usually in an octahedral coordination - like cobalt in LiCoO2 - lithium cobalt oxide to you battery heads out there), you can induce a change in the magnetic moment because youre disturbing the octahedral coordination of the cobalt.

I am very confused, however, as to how one would tie gravity into things, when phonon activity is pretty well documented and is often associated w/ exactly what I described above, when dealing w/ magnetic materials

Hello TRoc and solidspin,

If sound waves cause B shifts then perhaps the thought experiment could be modified once again to show an anomaly in this dynamic to infer gravitomagnetism using infrasound at the 12 hz frequency. That's the frequency I have in mind.

I had mentioned the doppler effect using infrasound (if that is possible) and looking at the wave distribution for anomalies. The challenge is seeing this effect that may be very small. The premise is a mass moving through a gravitational field creates gravitomagnetism. The strategy now is setting up a base line using infrasound at 12 hz and measuring the resultant B shift if that is possible.

If that is doable, then here is the revised thought experiment:

We want to see an anomaly in the B shift when infrasound is used at 12 hz. If mass moving through a gravitational field creates gravitomagnetism, then there would be optimal times in the year to see this effect. My thought is that the best time is approaching in June at the Summer Soltice.

If an anomaly in the B shift occurs it may be most noticeable between Full Moon and New Moon. Where the Sun and Moon are in line and later diametrically opposed. An increase or decrease in the B shift would infer gravitomagnetism in operation.


Tom

Tom,

Now I have to ask - why 12 hz?

Also, what changes are you looking for? .. mass?

I'm just trying to see the connection of gravity and magnetism (not philosophically, but literally at what junction can we look for it)


TRoc

Hello TRoc,

I am hoping that others like you will fill in the specifics with your expertise and open didactic sharing on the broader vision statement so to speak on how the this thought experiment may be shaped into something workable or perhaps open up an avenue for further exploration and insights.

These are my thoughts. Infrasound is the fequency range that may show an interrelationship between gravity and magnetism for moving bodies. Angular momentum may have a relationship to gravitational magnetism. Mass may change in certain circumstances in this relationship. There may be a dynamic- changing gravitational pull between all the planets in our solar system and int some instances their relative position exerts a type of gravitational leverage on these bodies.

The obstacle is how does one see the changes here on Earth through skillful strategies since gravitational magnetism has yet to be detected by any current state of the art sensors. The notion of the Sun and other planets exerting a combined and at times leveraged pull on the Earth has largely been discarded with GR. The idea that this pull has a magnetic component to it is speculation.

The thought experiment is surfacing the notion that gravitational magnetism may be validated here via the premise that a mass moving through a gravitational field creates gravitomagnetism. The means of doing this is through the infrasound frequency range that shows anomalies or perhaps as you suggested anomalies in a corresponding B shift related to that frequency.

The change in the latest revision to the thought experiment is the relative positions of the Sun, Moon and Earth and the resultant change in the gravitational pull on the Earth that may translate to gravitomagnetic changes. A change in the B shift or other anomaly may validate this correspondence.

12 hz is a hypothesized infrasound frequency that may be matched to this celestial combination to show the gravitomagnetic anomaly here on Earth with a possible corresponding B shift. It is a starting frequency to see if there is a type of ressonance.

To see a gravitomagnetic anomaly for Mars then another infrasound frequency would be used to see the resultant B shift.

So what is being put forward is an idea that all celestial bodies have a gravitomagnetic interrelationship here on Earth and that this relationship may show up downstream so to speak in specific infrasound frequency ranges.

Skillful strategies may be developed using infrasound to detect anomalies that indicate changes in the gravitational pull of the planets and our Sun that affect the Earth magnetic field (gravitomagnetic component of the Earths magnetic field). Specific gravitomagnetic effects of planet may be able to be isolated at specific infrasound frequencies. Any mass moving through a gravitational field would have the same dynamic.

Troc, those are my thoughts.

Tom

Tom,

Well, I dont know too much about gravitiomagnetsim, but lets take some stabs at it.


I dont think that you could measure a change in mass because the average # of electrons would stay the same during an oscillation.

I think you might "catch a wave" of gravity with the proper harmonic wavelegth(s), using either a 12hz sound wave, and a 12hz magnetic field. (12 may not be the magic #)

This would be an attempt at measuring the change on a travelling sound wave (90 to Earth) by gravity waves.

I dont have time at the moment to post the idea..
back soon


TRoc

ps. - fill in the space with your thoughts of the biological effects of this study (infrasonic)

If you are trying to measure a 12 Hz magnetic wave, that's a huge problem in itself -- you'd likely have to get the U.S. military to activate their ULF antenna arrays (used to contact submarines) ... hopefully the array could be used to measure such low frequency waves (assuming that the gravity wave produces an oscillating magnetic field and is able to radiate that field, producing an electromagnetic wave that we can measure via antennas). Otherwise, you would have to spin/move some sort of material through the magnetic field to cause sufficient changes (which would have to be above the normal ambient field strength, so this might only be possible in space) in the magnetic field orientation to induce a measurable electric current in the material.

Hello Troc and Bryan,

Infrasound having a physiological effect on the human body- epecially the emotions was a tell of sorts that this frequency range of sound may be a link to gravitomagnetism. Though I use the word gravitomagnetism, it is in actuality associated with the Gravity Probe B mission and GR. Gravitational Magnetism (Blackwell, Nobel Prize Cosmic Rays) is not associated with GR, as I understand it, and may be a more accurate description of this dynamic. It really depends on which line of thinking/theory is proven true. My ideas on the subject may be further afield than these two. I still like to interchange gravitomagnetism and gravitational magnetism when discussing this phenomenon. The word gravitomagnetism will eventually stick no matter how it is proven.

One premise to consider is that electromagnetism is different from gravitomagnetism. This is a very important point and implies quite a bit if one thinks about it for a while. Of course, we know a lot about electromagnetism and nothing about gravitomagnetism. The reason is that this force is very weak and undetectable to date. So as Troc kindly asked, I will attempt to fill up some blank space with thoughts as to why infrasound affects the human body the way it does. I am not in any way an expert on infrasound but can see some possible connections.

A second premise to consider is that gravitomagnetism affects emotions because emotions are created as and sensed as subtle magnetic energy by the body- specifically gravitomagnetic sourced energy. This may be the reason why infrasound can be heard "inside the head" so to speak, because it by passes the mechanical eardrum and is directly interpreted by the body as electrical stimulus. I will explain why later.

My view is that biological life depends upon gravitomagnetism in it processes that
has only been discussed in Asian literature as Chi energy and associated with meridians, chakras and subtle energy flow- a myth to most Western scientists and scientific thought. Hope I have not lost anyone here. These are tells as well if you can scrape off the layers of dogma.

Here is a key point leading into infrasound. If emotions are formed with subtle magnetic energy and the body interprets emotions as subtle magnetic energy then ones emotions can be influenced by outside sources. Another way of saying this is that our emotions my not be entirely a personal thing. What you feel as an emotion may have, at times, an external subtle magnetic source be it someone elses emotions or a source that resonates at the fequency of an emotion.

Why does infrasound affect emotions if it is a sound wave?

My thought is that it has a causual link to gravitomagnetism. It is a two way street so to speak. Gravitomagnetism may create infrasound at specific frequencies and infrasound may create gravitomagnetism. TRoc brought up an interesting point about B shifts in magnetic fields. He knows about that and I don't, but it is interesting and may help connect some of the dots.

Here is an example of the process. Lets say that infrasound is being created locally by the wind moving at just the right velocity through the maple and cottonwood trees in your neighborhood. The leaves are vibrating at just the right frequency and creating infrasound. If infrasound is present then there is also the presence of gravitomagnetic energy which would affect the human body and be interpreted as an emotion.

External subtle magnetic energy can influence other physiological processess aside from emotions and may explain nausea and other symptoms associated with infrasound. I suppose it would depend upon the power of the infrasound and the frequencies. The flow of subtle magnetic energy in the body may be adversely affected in this case. I doubt if all infrasound experiences are unpleasant.

Mass moving through a gravitational field creates gravitational magnetism and the tell here with movement of the leaves and air through the Earth's gravitational field is infrasound. This is my speculation on why infrasound affects the human body.


Tom

all

Lets be clear on what we want to do:

1. measure changes in the effect of gravity
2. use the Earth's magnetic field lines
3. use infrasonic sound waves (<30hz) to generate pressure changes
in a medium
4. determine the relationship, if any, with magnetism, gravity, and sound waves
in the ELF frequency band - in the 12 hz area.

correct?

As you can see from the replies, the information and understanding of waves of these frequencies are not "in tune". Several different areas of physics overlap here, and there are several names for the same things; and most importantly, standard rules break down in this region. (from both directions)

We dont need so much to worry about ELF waves being generated by the US Navy in Michigan or Wisconsin, they are in the 76hz area. (Russia is 82hz)

We do need to be thinking about Schuman Resonance, and the positions of the Moon and the Sun.

TRoc

Hello Troc,

Look forward to the process.

From the information I have gleaned, the Infrasound range is 1 to 20hz below the threshold of hearing -ours-. I will explore the Schuman Resonance information you have shared.

Tom

all


First, a bit of digging provided promising info.

Certain frequencies (and their harmonics) caused by earthquakes have wavelengths long enough to set the Earth in a "free oscillation" state (standing wave). These move in 2 ways: spheroidal (toward the Earth's center) and toroidal (away from), and are similar to (but not exactly) P-waves and S-waves (compressional / shear).

The "medium" that they oscillate in is gravitational attraction and elasticity.

The rotation of the Earth comes into play, as well as distance from center, etc. Which seems similar to the link to gravitiomagnetism that you (Tom) provided, as well as the question at hand.

segway > question at hand

Here is my idea for an experiment(s):

Construct a "tuned" tube about 3' dia. by a full wave distance, which for 12 hz is 27.5833 meters. Along nodal and antinodal points, attach ribbon microphones (which measure pressure velocity) at 4 equidistant points inside the tube. At one end, mount an 18" speaker and enclosure with built in amplifier and tone generator. Also attatch a device on the coil to accuratley (1000mm?) measure the "throw" of the speaker (magnet to coil relative positions) to serve as a control at the generation end of the wave.

At the other end, suspended from the sides so as to be in the center of the tube, and just past the end would be another sensor. I have a couple of different ideas, but it suffices to say that this sensor would measure the rate of atomic tunneling. It has been shown that when "relaxed state phonons" (the equilibrium or resonant frequency of a poly-atomic(+) molecules) in certain solids and crystals is changed, the rate of tunneling can be determined and/or controlled.

Essentialy, this sensor is like a tuned cicuit, and once made will always react the same to a specific frequency. So any deviations in the signal wave arriving at the end of the tube would show up in the rate of tunneling, and could be mapped out using the data from the ribbon mics pressure velocity readings along it's path.

Now to alter the magnetic field. We are going to do it the easy way, by changing location in a fixed field (along the Earth's lines of flux). The experiment would run at several angles. 1. N-S and parallel to B field, 2. S-N and parallel, 3. 90 degrees to surface (perpendicular to B field), 4. W-E and perpendicular (and with Earth's spin), 5. E-W, pependicular, and against spin. The timing of these experiments would need to be at the 4 quadrant positions of the moon, with #3 above to be aligned with Full moon on Solar eclipse. The direction of the wave tube would, in one set, be towards the moon, and then, in a different set of experiments, away from. This would help define lunar effects. The same opposing sets of experiments could be done at the different seasons to register the Sun's effect most clearly.

Lastly, the tube could be placed in a tunnel dug to half of its' depth, and ran in both directions, (up / down) and at several different elevations around the world (my funding price just went up, hehea) to see the results from different pressure levels.
This would also all be needed to take place at locations which have been sonically mapped for geologic structure and composition so that we could account for any lava tubes, oil-gas-mineral deposits, aquifers, etc. that might change the Earth's background frequency of 7.8hz (FM). A second mic, away from the tubes' mics, would record this tone in the ground so that we could remove it from the recorded signal.

When all the data is compliled, we have many ways to see the possible effects. Now to run all experiments again with a different frequency, and ultimately, with a wider bandwidth of 3+ frequencies, using triad harmonics. The preferred set would be 7.8, 9.3, and12.3hz, netting us with an exact BFH* of 12hz. (*BFH = beat frequency harmonic, aka "chord").

for now..
enough

TRoc

Hello Troc and everyone,

You certainly have put considerable thought into this.

I continue to wrestle with how one demonstrates the changes that infers gravitomagnetism, Sun, Moon, Earth's magnetic field, etc. when things are pretty much in a stable and balanced system so to speak with respect to the Earth and the proposed gravitomagnetic effect is very weak, even more so than this experiment may show.

That is why I had been musing in the past that gravity assist trajectories of spacecraft may show some anomalies that linked angular momentum to gravitomagnetism. My thinking is the action of the spacecraft zipping in and out of a stable orbiting scenerio of that planet's transit around the Sun may show the changes.

Not too much good for us to consider as a do it yourself experiement.

I continue to hold the premise that infrasound may have a causual connection and in a way create an altered gravitomagnetic environment if applied in an optimal setting.

If we follow the revisions in the original thought experiment and add in a couple of ideas from other sites on gravitomagnetism such as angular momentum, gyroscopic effect, current flow and infrasound, they could be combined into an experiment to infer gravitomagnetism.

If you think about it a simple A/C electric motor or generator has these effects in play. My thought is that Infrasound, powerfully applied at some optimal frequency, may be the change agent to show anomalies in current flow, power output, phase, etc. to infer gravitomagnetism.

I know I am deviating significantly from the last thought experiement but perhaps it may show the anomalies we are looking for and attract the frugal investigator/innovator as well into our hunt for gravitomagnetism. Let me know your thoughts. I am far from an expert in this area as well.

Tom

Tom,


Let me explain in more detail.

First, remember that waves "reflect" when they change mediums. To what degree is largely dependent on angle of incidence, and resonance of the 2 mediums. In this case, pressure waves return up the tube with the same frequency that they came down on. After a few cycles, the phase settles down to 180 off of the signal wave, and standing waves form up the length of the tube. This creates an unchanging, and measurable state, like going from typing paper to gragh paper within our "controled" medium (the tube). You mentioned the "things are pretty much in a stable and balanced system so to speak with respect to the Earth", which is true - everything "on a normal day" is in relative equilibrium (there will still be MANY background frequencies that will have to be pulled out of the recorded signal).

We know that the Earth's magnetic field has a "preferred direction" (NS), and that gravity will have a "preferred direction" (straight line when Sun and/or Moon are closest), and of course the tube has "preferred direction". So, by changing the angle of the tubes' intersections with these forces, we can measure small deviations in the waveform. Perhaps the wave would speed up when in line/same direction of B field, or would shift to one side when perpendicular to Earth's rotation. The wave is going slow enough to measure dopler shifts in 3D.

However...
I did some reading on the subject last night, and I think 12 hz is not going to be low enough to "resonate" with gravity waves. Acoustic gravity waves are named so because they oscillate between the force of gravity and the elasticity (compressibility)of the Earth. The upper limit for this effect is at .01hz !

Luckily, they make microphones for frequencies even that low. I found a web page describing an experiment VERY similar to the one I proposed, that was made to moniter volcanic erruption noise...

http://pubs.usgs.gov/pinatubo/tahira/

My favorite quote from the paper:

"Microbaroms of considerable strength arrived from these directions and tended to mask the weak infrasonic signals from Mount Pinatubo. This background noise can be removed by using a numerical filter, since the pressure oscillations due to microbaroms are nearly monochromatic with dominant periods of 3 to 5 s, which are shorter than the infrasonic signals of interest. "

Talk about the other side of the coin! While the "in crowd" of Physics are doing things like figuring out how many attoseconds it takes for an electron to complete an orbit around the nucleus... these guys have to wait 3-5 seconds for the signal to finish coming in!! You can add "microbaroms" to the long list of different names given to "rates of vibration", they are the infrasonic waves made by rough sea waves.


Now, do you really want to take this in the direction of relating sound and AC ??


TRoc

Hello TRoc,

It will be interesting to see some of your novel ideas put into an experiment. Keep up the good work.

A/C phase shifts and infrasound needs more thought.

Tom

Hello TRoc,

The inverse doppler effect discussed in the article on em frequencies is quite interesting.

Any thoughts on what the inverse doppler effect of infrasound would show- if such a phenonmenon could be produced; e.g. gravitomagnetism link?

Tom

Tom,

When I mentioned "a 3D doppler effect", that would include inverse doppler. All of the ribbon mic.s would pick up identical signals, unless gravity and/or magnetism (in the same frequency range) shifted the waveform.

For instance, if the tube was parallel to a direct line between the Earth and the Moon, and the direction of the wave in the tube was towards the Moon, I would expect the wave to be doppler shifted towards the Moon. While both bodies are generating the same gravitational frequency, the Earth's gravity waves will be a much larger amplitude, pushing the tube wave ahead of its' normal equilibrium. If we were using 12hz, the mic.s closer to the source end might read 11hz, while at the other end, we get 13hz.

To get the inverse doppler effect, we line the tube up between the Sun and the Earth in the same fashion, and the Suns' larger amplitude slows our tube wave down. Now the mic.s near the source should read 13hz, and at the other end, 11hz.

The reason for also conducting the experiments in a perpendicular direction would be to measure the same effects in the tube caused by magnetism (if any).


TRoc

Hello TRoc,

I will give some serious thought to what you are sharing. Quite interesting.

What if gravity does not travel as a wave (GR) but is more like the ebb and flow of the tide so to speak. In this scenario gravitomagnetism would be the wave and infrasound linked to it in some sort of causal relationship. All the planets in our solar system would then have an interdependent gravitomagnetic dynamic.

Tom

Tom,


I certainly believe that our systems' planets (and galactic, and universal) are interconnected by way of the combined waves (light, gravity, etc.) that bear down on a selected sphere. (the Earth in this case)

Can you expound on the tide analogy for G-waves?


more on the biological side of these frequencies:

I would inject the following step in the process you mentioned ("emotions are created as and sensed as subtle magnetic energy by the body- specifically gravitomagnetic sourced energy") - just that the energy excites molecules of a gland, that produces chemicals that induce states that we define as a specific emotion.

Not to say that this is not perceived as instantaneous, and that the distance function can not be mysterious. The range of frequencies that humans can sense in one way or another is astounding; and then transferred and processed in our cpu/brain where it is separated into logical groups of reality. At any given moment, our brain is actively ignoring more signals than it is allowing us to be aware of. The brain is not "in charge", your focus (free will) is what sets the parameters for the brains' signal bandwidth. Your environment dictates, to the largest extent, the choices that you have on what to focus on externally, but ultimately, we all must choose.

I'm curious as to the source and/or reason for choosing 12hz...


TRoc

Hello TRoc,

The tide analogy for gravity implies that it operates as a force that increases and decreases in value depending upon the location of the other planets and the Sun in respect to Earth. This is a dynamic process. In this view, the Sun really does hold the other planets in their respective orbits due to its gravitational pull and not from the warping of space-time into channels where the planets follow a route around the Sun like a marble traveling down a goove in a wood board.

We are kind of regressing back to the notion that the Earth is the center of the cosmos when it comes to understanding gravitomagnetism and its interaction with all the planets- though we know the Earth isn't the center :-)

The link to the web site discussing the possibility that the Earth's magnetic field is a product of it moving through the Sun's gravitational field was given in an earlier post.
Gravitomagnetism would then be created from the Earth traveling through the gravitational pull of the Sun as well as gravitational affect from the other planets.

In this model, Angular momentum would have a relationship to gravitomagnetism.

The link to infrasound may be that each planet respectively has its own unique gravitomagnetic signature that shows up down stream as an infrasound frequency on Earth.

The mystery is how does it happen? My view is that gravity is not moving like a wave nor is gravitomagnetism moving through space like electromagnetism. It may behave more like an analogy of light moving through a prism. In this case the movement of a mass through a gravitational field shows the gravitmagnetic signatures of all the planetary bodies right here on Earth.

Each planet, our Moon and Sun may have their unique infrasound frequency from the causual effect these frequencies have with each celestial body's unique gravitomagnetic signature here on Earth.

So I will throw some values out- like darts on a board -intuitive:

Sun- 7 hz

Moon- 12hz

Mercury- 6 hz

Venus- 7.5 hz

Mars- 10 hz

Jupiter- 1.6 hz

Saturn- 1.3 hz

Uranus- .6 hz

Neptune- .4 hz

Pluto- .32 hz

12 hz was given earlier as you were thinking of using the movement of the Moon through its phases in the experiement and it seems the most logical relationship to experiment with.

If the Moon plays a large role in the movement of the Earth's tides, the gravitational force is there to experiment with. Perhaps a good tide book will help as well.


TRoc, my view is that the subtle magnetic energy of emotions is not instaneously transmitted but conforms to how other magnetic fields and energy operate here on Earth as it moves out from the person or oneself.

There is also another connection we all have to one another that scientists call quantum teleportation. The healing energy arts refer to this dynamic as dowsing. Both terms describe a similar phenomenon where information is transmitted over long distances without any apparent method of transmission.

The difference is that in dowsing energy is transmitted as well aside from just information. My thought is this is all linked to the paradigm I am discussing and you are attempting to put into a workable experiment. One step at a time.

Tom

Tom,


OK - I get the tide analogy now. Very much like an atom with a large # of electrons, and the force experienced by the outer electrons being shielded by both distance from the nucleus, and the other, closer electrons. I think you could break it down to primary effect (large, center body like the Sun or nucleus), and secondary (the effects of "orbiting peers"), and then tertiary (other "systems" - both "orbitees" and "orbitors")


If you bring angular momentum into the conversation about gravitiomagnetism (GM), then we should bring up the Earths' precession. The unanswered question is still "what causes it?". Is it something with the Earths' core that manifests outwardly, or something from "out there" that causes the wobble?


Also, on your quote "my view is that the subtle magnetic energy of emotions is not instaneously transmitted but conforms to how other magnetic fields and energy operate here on Earth as it moves out from the person or oneself" - don't you agree that these fields are already in place all around us, and we exist in a state of their equilibrium?

"Instantaneous" may still not be the proper term, because TIME and DISTANCE are irrelevent to these anomolies. Things can be "sensed" before they happen. This is the reason I mentioned our brains' abilty to ignore the majority of signals, we would all be emotional wrecks if not for this ability. This vibrational equilibrium that we exist in is spherical-rotational in nature, and as such, when applying the conservation of angular momentum, you must accept that 1/2 of our reality is going the other way! Time can not be linear as we peceive it -- I am born, I live, then I die: therefore time = linear is pure sensory illusion. This is enough of an answer to me to explain why some "sensations" happen outside of these self-created boundaries.

Our personal struggles for self improvement can still be thought of as linear, and dealing with emotions is certainly a big part of that. However, on a grand scale (evolution), we have to stick with the circular, cyclical premise. As the precession of the Earths' wobble goes through its' cycle (~26,000 yrs), it acts to control the amount of higher frequency radiation that is allowed to enter our reality (through the changing protective magnetic field). These are the opposite of "subtle magnetic energy", and can not be "ignored". One needs to look no further than studies on the biological effects (mutations) of high energy waves (x-rays & up) on cell formation.

Now we really have opened up the breadth of this topic. If we begin to look at relationships between gravity and magnetism, we may begin to unveil the relationship between cosmology and evolution! Can we ignore the patterns that we have "discovered" in the last 100 yrs?

We know that :

our "poles" are slowly drifting,
our magnetic field is weakening,
the "fixed" remnants (ice) of spin and magnetic maximum (poles) are changing,
the "fixed" geometry of Oxygen (ozone) is changing,
a change in magnetic field causes the proton to precess, (causing O geometry shift)
more high energy waves are reaching the Earth in recent time,
human evolution (mental) has increased phenomenally in recent time,
nuerological disorders are being treated with Low frequency waves, (excess energy being dissipated)
human emotions (fear/greed) are reaching a frenzied state,
(the battle for resources has just begun)
mass extinctions (of group A) bring about evolutionary leaps (in group B ),
in a non-zero spin state, the magnetic moment is not parallel with angular momentum, (anomalous zeeman effect)
Universal perspective (relativity) dictates a certain direction for spin (non-zero), (only by the observer changing position can the mathematical idea of conservation of angular momentum be realized)
(Therefore, as our solar sytems' position changes relative to the galactic center in an orbital fashion, there should be times (1/2 period ~13,000 yrs) when our spin state IS zero from a universal perspective. This means regular periods of parallel states icing up at the poles, countered by off-center low points of icing down)
the "icing up" coincides with mass extinctions,
the "icing" down coincides with leaps of evolution,

Leading to:



I HAVE NO IDEA!!!


TRoc

Hello TRoc,

Lot's of anomalies and interesting questions to ponder. **** The goal is to find a simple experiment to show that gravitomagnetism exists. So we have been discussing infrasound and its possible relationship to gravitomagnetism.

Not a lot of money bouncing around for supplies and experrments these days. Money, as usual, is the gate keeper for research. So with limited resources science stays focused on areas that have shown promise in the past.

Kind of like book publishers who keep tapping the well of published authors and not taking the risk on new work. One then self publishes and shoe-string inventors work out of their garage.

My thought is the contribution that gravitomagnetism adds to the Earth's magnetic field is pretty stable. It may be more like a feeder current and/or source magnetism to the process discussed in the "Dynamo" theory concerning geomagnetism.

Precession could be caused by other things aside from the twisting of space-time such as perturbations in the transits of the planets. My thought is that they deviate somewhat from the direct path and if they approach too close to the transit of another their gravitational effect would cause changes.

The Sun may be influenced in the same way not only from gravitational leverage of the smaller planets in orbit but from other yet similar influences not yet understood. When everything is leveraged just right there may be a tipping point of sorts. Maybe once an eon a moon gets set free from it orbit and has a catastrohic effect on the whole system. There may be celestial bodies coming into our solar system that does the same thing. There are countless possibilities not to mention those you mentioned such as wobble in the Earth's rotation due to tidal waves, earthquakes, ice cap melts, etc.

Perhaps some of our frugal inventor/researcher friends can put some of the ideas concerning infrasound and gravitomagetism to the test.

To this day, I still feel drawn by the notion that spinning a heated material that is very susceptible to mangetization at a high rate of rotation while it cools will show an anomaly in its magnetic field beyond what would be expected by the Earth's magnetic field for that specific location. Any one up to the challenge or has this idea been thoroughly been tested?

Tom

Hello TRoc and everyone,

I have been putting together some audio wav files in order to demonstrate, somewhat crudely, the link between sound and gravitomagentism. What I am attempting to demonstrate is that our emotions can be influenced by an outside subtle magnetic source. In this particular case it is the possible link that sound has to gravitomagnetism- especially in the infrasound and lower frequency sound ranges.

The notion again is that mass moving through a gravitational field creates a gravitomagnetic field.

Sound frequency may have a causal link to gravitomagnetism. This is possible because as sound moves through the gravitational pull of the Earth it is creating a very subtle magnetic field of energy that can be sensed by the human body. This implies that an emotion can be generated in the body if the sound frequency for that emotion is closely matched.

Here are some audio wav files I have put together that roughly approximate four emotions or feelings. My suggestion is playing them on Windows Media Player with the play function set to the "repeat" mode. Do not play the files too loud as we are not trying to blast our ears. One minute should be enough to get the sense of the wav file for a specific emotion/feeling. They will be subtle and a rough approximation for that sensation. I think you will be surprised with the effect they have and the insight that our emotions really can be stimulated from an outside magnetic source.


Joy- http://www.reikiflow.com/joy.wav

Sadness- http://www.reikiflow.com/sad.wav

Anger- http://www.reikiflow.com/anger.wav

Sneeze- http://www.reikiflow.com/sneeze.wav


Tom

Tom,


Interesting sound waves, very similar to recordings of earthquakes (sped up to a hz that we can hear).


I just got back from a trip, and did some internet searching when I had the chance. I found this site http://www.ligo.caltech.edu/ on gravity waves. You can go to the American Museum of Natural History Project on Gravitational Waves for some interesting things (the video is good).

Their experiment is set up (again) very similar to my sound tube idea, which is encouraging. They have a project that allows people to "donate" their background computing capabilities to the LIGO data called EINSTEIN@HOME. I have donated my cpu, perhaps you would be interested too. (I'm going to post a thread on this forum to encourage other users to do the same) They need all the computing power they can get !


TRoc

Hello TRoc and everyone,

Continuing with the causal link between sound waves (lower frequency/infrasound) and gravitomagnetism, it may open the possibility of monitoring emotions remotely. In an earlier post I put together some very rough and subtle approximations for three emotions/feelings. The idea being that what we are feeling and thinking is naturally translated into an emotion that has a frequency signature.

Working from the inside out in this process, the idea being put forward is that specific sound frequency combinations may initiate unique and specific emotional responses in a test subject depending on what the topic was such as sadness, pain, anger, etc.
The next step would be convert the sound frequencies into a working electromagnetic model.

My thought is that these frequencies may even be fine tuned to indicate specific premeditated acts such as a violent act that is being contemplated but not carried out yet. Using a sensational example, a terrorist bomber may emanate an emotion indicating a violent act is immanent. As I mentioned, the freqencies may be able to be fined tuned to the degree of showing the difference between a planned bombing and a hijacking. At the very least, intense anger or fear would flash warning signs to security personnel at monitoring stations.

Here is a link discussing some ideas on this and gravitomagnetism in general. My Webpage

Tom

Do you know what is really scarry about the idea of "remote viewing/detecting of people's thoughts and emotions/emitions" ?

What if the emotion or thought a person is having is about a movie they are watching or a book they are reading or a conversation they are listening to etc.

If the remote detection is not "viewing" the complete context of the emotion/thought being interpreted -- there is a dangerous possiblity of missinterpretation.

Let's say someone is watching an old Alfred Hitchcok film about murder. Their thoughts would be about that subject. But they themselves are not engaged in that subject.

Or, lets say the situation is even more subtle than that. What if a person is sitting in a chair at the airport after having watched this Hitchcok movie and simply thinking about the movie and the murder that it was about.

The context of watching a movie that generated these thoughts would not be obvious to "security" detectors and the person having the thoughts might be harrased by the "security" people for no good reason.

Of course a thought could be "introuduced" into a person's mind intentionally as well. This thought could also be missinterpreted by anyone, or any detection system, not being privy to the fact that the "harmful thought" was intentionally "introduced".

Scarry stuff.

shamanka

Hi,

There has been theoretical and experimental work indicating that the gravitational mass of a medium can be manipulated by certain types of electromagnetic fields properly introduced into the medium.

For those interested, here are two papers i have come across relating to this subject.

http://www.intalek.com/Papers/GMF.pdf

http://www.frandeaquino.org/Nuclear%20Fusion.pdf

z

Hello Shamanka,

In our world of opposites everything can be be used
both for harm and for benefit. What I described in the
posting is a natural phenomenon that many perceive
right now. I think it is better to have this dialog
and discussion out in the open as you are sharing
rather than keeping it in the realm of secrecy of
groups where harm can really occur.

If I were boarding an airplane, I would very much like
to know that scanning was occurring to detect the
presence of a bomber or hijacker.

Yes, nothing is fool proof and this methodology is no
different. The point is not that it be a die hard
litmus test but more of a warning to look further.

Thanks Z for the links.

Best wishes,

Tom

Hello everyone,


Here are two audio wav files that have been put together to match as best as possible the sound frequency that corresponds to the London and Iraq terrorists respectively. As discussed in early posts, it may be possible to create a electromagnetic profile of an emotion which can be monitored remotely that identifies a terrorist.

http://www.reikiflow.com/london-terrorists.wav

http://www.reikiflow.com/iraq-terrorists.wav



Tom

Hello everyone,

I have been working lately with sound wave frequencies as a method of demonstrating the effect of gravitomagnetism (gravitational magnetism) in operation. As discussed in previous posts, the idea is that a mass moving through the pull of gravity creates gravitomagnetism or in this specific case, a sound wave moving through a medium displaces that medium (mass) and creates a very subtle gravitomagnetic field.

In this model, a change in gravitomagnetism may be demonstrated in a process coined as imprinting or as a friend of mine (Ian) wrote , "GravMag imprints". This phenomenon if proven to be correct, is based on a rotation and annealing experiment discussed earlier in this thread. Currently, we are substituting sound for rotation. The sound waves do not have to limited to the infrasound range. Any audio wave will most likely work.

One simply heats a chosen material, and plays an audio wave for about five minutes then quenches the material in water. That is essentially the imprinting process. One most likely could let the heated material cool to ambient temperature while playing the audio wave continuously.

Being a frugal inventor, I used an audio tone generator, candle and computer/speakers. (All safety precautions adhered to). Since we are interested in the gravitational magnetic relationship to sound waves, a high volume setting is not necessary. No need to blast one ears or feel uncomfortable. Glass, ceramics, U.S. penny etc. can be imprinted.

Though I can personally feel an increase in the magnetic field of these materials, they do not attract metal as one normally thinks of magnetism and magnets. The field is weak but perhaps more compatible with the physical body.

Here is a link to a web page discussing possible healing frequencies for investigation and research:

http://www.reikiflow.com/healing-wavs.htm

Of course they are untested and speculative at this point but may point one in the right direction if the proposed relationship between GravMag and sound is proven to be correct.

One other thought experiment to demonstrate GravMag imprinting could be in meteorites that have fallen in colder Polar regions. Pristine samples laying on the ice or snow may have been imprinted as they fell to Earth. Along this same line of reasoning, as my friend Ian discussed, ancient meteor impact sites on Earth may still show some GravMag imprinting. Though many meterites are already known to be magnetic, does GravMag imprinting play into this process?

Tom

Hello everyone,

One possibility in determining if there is a gravitational magnetism (gravitomagnetism/gravmag) effect on Earth from the planets in our solar system and other celestial bodies is to create a real-time computer program for GravMag charting.

If a mass moving through a gravitational field creates gravitomagnetism, then the links may show up here on Earth as subtle impact/influences on emotions and also on behavior. GravMag charting may be useful as a real-time "Farmer's Almanac" so to speak.

This type of charting may also help correlate natural occurring infrasound to other events such as earthquakes, magma flows, etc. or the entry of celestial objects such as meteors into our solar system.

Best wishes,

Tom

If there is a link between sound and magnetism via gravitomagnetism, a new approach may be possible for increasing efficiencies in propeller, impeller and turbine designs be the medium a gas (air) or a fluid. Related to this idea is the aerodynamic concept of Lift when viewed in a terms of gravitomagnetism; air (mass) moving through a gravitational field creates a subtle magnetic field. There may be a possibility that certain materials used in wing design or the construction of a turbine blade, propeller etc. may have properties that enhance these very subtle magnetic fields. Using Lift as an example, the materials could be used to enhance the subtle magnetic differential between wind surfaces that create these efficiencies.

Since gravitomagnetism is yet to be validated, how does one go about investigating the proposed efficiencies in wind turbines, airplane wing design and other mechanical devices? The answer may be in monitoring the sound waves produced by these devices and correlating the sound patterns produced to the efficiencies monitored with the introduction in design changes. The idea here is sound waves moving through a medium displaces that medium and creates gravitomagnetism. This is the proposed link between sound, magnetism and gravity.

Taking the next step in efficiency would be the introduction of materials/composites that may enhance the subtle magnetism of the device. My thought is that changes in the sound wave patterns will indicated a change in the gravitomagnetic patterns as well.

Tom

Tom,


Just wanted to drop in and offer a couple of tidbits for your cause.

A good article of increasing the effectiveness of propellers, around WWII US Navy work, is linked HERE.
It gets to the heart of what we term "sound", and the tremendous energy that the cause of it generates. A collapsing bubble, or in other terms, a jump in amplitude of a scalar spherical wave, is the cause. These, in turn, are created/destroyed by the reversal of ratio of local (internal) to medium (external) pressures. Temperature plays a large role in that, when in a medium dominated by mass. In a medium not dominated by mass, or "vacuum"-like, it is the area surrounding the mass in question. With "still frame", dualistic approach, the "field" idea comes out. I think the better path is for the "video" (moving frame) taken from afar. This shows both sides of the duality, and results in a changing spherical wave model (scalar).

In our previous talks, I said "lining up" (90 deg) the moon or sun with the experiment on the Earth should give good results. Think about "splitting" the scalar in a symmetrical way, allowing for the duality to become apparent without being in some remote location. In this sense, we are putting the experiment in the "local" pressure area, and judging the pressure of the external medium accordingly.

At any rate, I have been working on a model that can predict earthquakes. It is not complete yet, but is producing GOOD results. Not necessarily "good" by my standards, and I'm sure of those following the thread, but when compared to the "predictions" of the combined might of Science: " a 70% chance of a >6.5 in the LA area in the next 5 years" or something to that affect, it looks very good.

The last prediction I made was just recently. It didn't start off very accurate, and that can be mainly attributed to my calculations based on "estimates"; so I am neither surprised or disappointed. However, one thing I can say for sure is: a wave of energy, released from the Sun on Jan 21st, hit our planet this morning (local PAC time). This wave logically has a maximum at the point of directly overhead position of the Sun, and generates very large fluctuations in our magnetosphere. These large fluctuations in the magnetic field should, as you have been looking into, generate fluctuations in the gravitational field as well. With that in mind, please read the following news: LINK

A prayer for those lives lost.

I have to take in as much empirical data as possible to further refine my approach. Even seemingly "unrelated" things like this can help. Ground conditions dictate the final "effect" that we see, and this looks to be no different. The building sunk down, wobbled, and collapsed. Now take into consideration of the local time: "just after lunch", and my estimated time of arrival of this slow wave: ~15:00 UTC. Isn't it reasonable to think that a fluctuation in gravitational waves played a part in this?


TRoc

Hello TRoc,

I followed your link to the page on "Bubble Puzzles". It is interesting how powerful collapsing bubbles can be as discussed concerning ship prop damage due to cavitation. As I recall, Russia and lately the U.S. are using super cavitation for extreme speed torpedo technology.

Taking this line of thinking to an extreme, there was recent speculation (Japan I think) that the Earth's outer mantle rotates at a different speed than that near our planet's core. Is there a possibility that the "cavitation effect" could be a factor here in that bubbles of magma or other liquified material are created between the two rotating bodies that later collapse and create earthquakes?

Thought this might pique your interest